Australian (ASX) Stock Market Forum

Electric cars?

Would you buy an electric car?

  • Already own one

    Votes: 10 5.2%
  • Yes - would definitely buy

    Votes: 43 22.2%
  • Yes - preferred over petrol car if price/power/convenience similar

    Votes: 78 40.2%
  • Maybe - preference for neither, only concerned with costs etc

    Votes: 36 18.6%
  • No - prefer petrol car even if electric car has same price, power and convenience

    Votes: 23 11.9%
  • No - would never buy one

    Votes: 14 7.2%

  • Total voters
    194
Recon I am a sceptic of the rear view cameras as well.

Friend just bought the BMW electric car the other day after owning a Tesla.
i guess the ( rear-view ) camera will need it's own wiper ( or maybe just a motor kill-switch until you clean the camera lens ... LOL )

going to take the fun out of parking by braille ( a frequently used Queensland technique )
 
Not electric cars but hybrid trains in Adelaide.

Before anyone says "but electric trains already exist" well yes they do, but not all lines are electrified and to electrify an old train line costs big $ for both the power supply and new trains as well as bringing height issues where tunnels exist.

So this system is a retrofit to existing diesel-electric trains at much lower cost to capture otherwise wasted energy, that is regenerative braking, with consequent saving on fuel costs estimated at 20%.

The video's rather "polished" corporate promotion but shows what's it's about:

 
Not electric cars but hybrid trains in Adelaide.

Before anyone says "but electric trains already exist" well yes they do, but not all lines are electrified and to electrify an old train line costs big $ for both the power supply and new trains as well as bringing height issues where tunnels exist.

So this system is a retrofit to existing diesel-electric trains at much lower cost to capture otherwise wasted energy, that is regenerative braking, with consequent saving on fuel costs estimated at 20%.

The video's rather "polished" corporate promotion but shows what's it's about:


Makes sense
 
This affects all new cars, but as this is the only dedicated car thread, i'll post it here.


Recent legislation now requires all new cars sold in Europe to have speed-limiting devices fitted, beginning this Sunday, 7 July 2024.
The technology, called intelligence speed assistance (ISA), is now mandatory for all brand-new cars in the European Union, and can either warn drivers when they're driving over the posted limit or actively prevent the vehicle from speeding.

Manufacturers have four available options under EU regulations if the ISA detects speeding: a gentle pushback on the throttle, an autonomous reduction in engine power, haptic throttle pedal vibrations combined with visual alerts (which escalate if ignored), or flashing visual cues followed by audible alerts.
Drivers are said to be able to intervene and override the technology.
 
Makes sense
i was only in Adelaide for a couple of days when there , and didn't use the local train service whilst there , i would think this while not be so efficient in the short term , but maybe mid-term term ( QLD is sometimes hit by electricity issues on their tracks/trains , i could see it being useful up here )

might be worth watching
 
i was only in Adelaide for a couple of days when there , and didn't use the local train service whilst there , i would think this while not be so efficient in the short term , but maybe mid-term term ( QLD is sometimes hit by electricity issues on their tracks/trains , i could see it being useful up here )

might be worth watching
In Adelaide the big advantage is it's a retrofit to existing diesel trains and it's one that's economically positive, the fuel cost saving pays for it in full, other aspects such as reduced pollution are effectively a free bonus.

Long term there's a plan to electrify the remaining non-electrified lines but in the meantime this hybrid system provides a meaningful improvement to the existing operations, and it's expected to recover all costs within the remaining life of the fleet (that is of course assuming the price of diesel fuel doesn't crash etc).

Another heavy vehicle electric application here, this time overseas. Electric garbage trucks in use in San Diego (amateur video not a documentary). Definitely a lot quieter which is a benefit as well as the efficiency gain for vehicles that travel just a few metres between stops.

As with public transport vehicles, parking when not in use at a depot of some sort, same place every day, means charging ought be straightforward to set up.

 
In Adelaide the big advantage is it's a retrofit to existing diesel trains and it's one that's economically positive, the fuel cost saving pays for it in full, other aspects such as reduced pollution are effectively a free bonus.

Long term there's a plan to electrify the remaining non-electrified lines but in the meantime this hybrid system provides a meaningful improvement to the existing operations, and it's expected to recover all costs within the remaining life of the fleet (that is of course assuming the price of diesel fuel doesn't crash etc).

Another heavy vehicle electric application here, this time overseas. Electric garbage trucks in use in San Diego (amateur video not a documentary). Definitely a lot quieter which is a benefit as well as the efficiency gain for vehicles that travel just a few metres between stops.

As with public transport vehicles, parking when not in use at a depot of some sort, same place every day, means charging ought be straightforward to set up.


And in both cases, the weight and stop start regime is a good fit to regenerative braking systems.
Trains even if better eith overhead lines, bin collection are imho the best fit for battery EV, much better than planes,ships with no recharging on braking, or personal cars for the masses
 
And in both cases, the weight and stop start regime is a good fit to regenerative braking systems.
Trains even if better eith overhead lines, bin collection are imho the best fit for battery EV, much better than planes,ships with no recharging on braking, or personal cars for the masses

EV’s as “Personal cars for the masses” use 90% for the primary energy vs only 20% for petrol cars, this makes them almost essential to the transition away from fossil fuels.

This video explains a lot of what the skeptics are concerned about, and shows we only need to replace about 50% of fossil fuels with renewable energy, because electric systems waste so much less energy, that efficiency increases will mean we need 50% less primary energy, so don’t need to replace 100% of fossil fuel.

 
LG energy, one of the larger Battery manufacturers suffered a significant fall in operating profits , attributing the fall due to the slowdown in EV sales.
From Zero Hedge

The news came a day after another South Korean battery major, SK On, declared an emergency after 10 consecutive quarters of losses stemming from trends in EV demand that have missed analyst and company expectations.
LG Energy and SK On are, respectively, the world’s third- and fourth-largest EV battery manufacturers.

Reporting on the LG Energy results, which are preliminary, Bloomberg noted a tax credit under the U.S. Inflation Reduction Act that helped the company stay in the black, Excluding that credit, LG Energy dipped into an operating loss of some $180,000.

SK On, for its part, has had worse luck than its bigger rival, without IRA tax credits to help it through the rough times.

The Financial Times reported on Sunday that the company had seen its net debt swell to about $10 billion over the last two years and a half, which was a fivefold increase in the period. The reason: EV sales have fallen short of projections—well short.

“We have our back against the wall,” chief executive Lee Seok-hee wrote in a letter to employees. “We should all pull together.”
The company appears to have made a string of sub-optimal decisions to get to this point, namely aggressive investments in Europe and the United States in anticipation of an EV boom, according to the Financial Times.

Unlike the South Korean battery makers, the two world leaders—BYD and CATL—are mostly exposed to their home market where EV sales are the strongest in the world, so they have been shielded by the disappointing sales numbers on the other two key markets for the vehicles.
Also from Zerohedge comes news that the onsale (second hand) market for electric pickup trucks has been falling and continues to fall.
Some people who bought trucks in the initial exuberance now find they are well below the MSRP.
Some early adopters of electric vehicle trucks who bought on secondary markets during the EV mania in recent years have been hammered by price collapses.

Using Bring A Trailer data, we analyzed auctions of four EV trucks: a GMC Hummer EV, a Ford F-150 Lightning EV, a Rivian R1T, and a Tesla Cybertruck. All of these trucks have seen sizeable price declines on the auction website.

Let's start with the GMC Hummer EV, which was heavily hyped and initially sold for a staggering $275k on the auction website in April 2022. Fast forward to today, and used Hummer EVs are now selling on the same site for around $100k, aligning near GMC's listed MSRP.
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Mick
 
LG energy, one of the larger Battery manufacturers suffered a significant fall in operating profits , attributing the fall due to the slowdown in EV sales.

Also from Zerohedge comes news that the onsale (second hand) market for electric pickup trucks has been falling and continues to fall.
Some people who bought trucks in the initial exuberance now find they are well below the MSRP.

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Mick
Why would you even buy a Hummer EV.
Isn't owning a Hummer all about being as noisy and as offensive as possible and that means burning diesel!

Typical Hummer owners.
ANT44EVXSPFLQ2MZRLEI56RD6Q.jpg
 
Why would you even buy a Hummer EV.
Isn't owning a Hummer all about being as noisy and as offensive as possible and that means burning diesel!

Typical Hummer owners.
View attachment 180309
No prejudice here?😂
You will soon discover that the same dickheads can gloat about their tesla tank in the same way. The "my dick and wallet is bigger than yours" is not linked to your voting preferences .
"I am educated, i do not vote Trump but Biden 🙃😭"
You should be aware, even reading ASF threads 😉
 
No prejudice here?😂
You will soon discover that the same dickheads can gloat about their tesla tank in the same way. The "my dick and wallet is bigger than yours" is not linked to your voting preferences .
"I am educated, i do not vote Trump but Biden 🙃😭"
You should be aware, even reading ASF threads 😉


It's all tongue in cheek. I'm joking .
Do you own one ;)
 
This video explains a lot of what the skeptics are concerned about, and shows we only need to replace about 50% of fossil fuels with renewable energy, because electric systems waste so much less energy, that efficiency increases will mean we need 50% less primary energy, so don’t need to replace 100% of fossil fuel.
Agreed - although the stop-start applications such as urban public transport and garbage collection vehicles are even more extreme than that, they're even better candidates due to the amount of braking they do, plus they have the advantage of never having to go to the middle of nowhere, always being parked at a known location for charging, etc.

They're low hanging fruit basically, they should in theory offer an excellent return on investment when compared to a less frequently used car that needs a longer range due to the nature of that use.

One public transport service I looked at in detail, there's a stop on average every 1.05km along the route from the CBD to outer suburbs and back. Done that way to maximise utility, because people don't like walking too far to get on or off, but it does mean an awful lot of braking and fuel inefficiency with internal combustion as the power source. So electric power and regenerative braking has a lot of benefits there.

And since the vehicle spends a few minutes parked at both ends of that trip, there's a layover period at the stop furthest out where it waits until a set time to depart in order to keep services on time, and the same also occurs in the CBD, that's a perfect opportunity for a top-up charge if needed. :2twocents
 
Agreed - although the stop-start applications such as urban public transport and garbage collection vehicles are even more extreme than that, they're even better candidates due to the amount of braking they do, plus they have the advantage of never having to go to the middle of nowhere, always being parked at a known location for charging, etc.

They're low hanging fruit basically, they should in theory offer an excellent return on investment when compared to a less frequently used car that needs a longer range due to the nature of that use.

One public transport service I looked at in detail, there's a stop on average every 1.05km along the route from the CBD to outer suburbs and back. Done that way to maximise utility, because people don't like walking too far to get on or off, but it does mean an awful lot of braking and fuel inefficiency with internal combustion as the power source. So electric power and regenerative braking has a lot of benefits there.

And since the vehicle spends a few minutes parked at both ends of that trip, there's a layover period at the stop furthest out where it waits until a set time to depart in order to keep services on time, and the same also occurs in the CBD, that's a perfect opportunity for a top-up charge if needed. :2twocents
Indeed, while i am fully opposed to these idiotic " no ice after xxx", there are cases where EVs make sense, and this should be reflected in the economics..
As long as government or supra national UN, WEF are not forcing an agenda, science and technology will progress via pure capitalism.
But once you tinkle with bans, subsidies and penalties, the sxxt happens , you go backward and you end up like the EU or Australia soon.
 
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